Daily Hand Quiz

B player is going to shove next hand so you have 3 hands to find a better hand than KQ…I prefer to call and try to triple-up.

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mesoanarchy Reply:
March 7th, 2010 at 8:20 am

2 people from the $$$$$…. you must wait it out. Glory only comes if U make the $$$$$.

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Call. We’ve got three-and-a-half big blinds, v has a wide range and it’s unlikely we are going to find a better spot than this in the next four hands.

Very often in these situations we’re up against a small-medium pocket pair, and with our miserly stack I’m happy to take a coin flip.

The fact that it is a 23k shove makes this opportunity all the more inviting, as it makes it unlikely that anyone else is going to call behind. I expect that the big blind is more interested in trying to win the tournement than in calling a quarter of his stack to knock two people out, so he will need a strong hand to get involved.

Our alternative is to wait and shove our short stack from early position, which is likely to induce several callers anyway, so even if we pick up a monster starting hand when we reach UTG we could find ourselves in worse shape than if we snap up this opportunity.

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Pokerkid Reply:
February 28th, 2010 at 7:06 pm

KQ is not that great of a hand to call 23k. although we have 3 big blinds left, im sure in 10-15 hands well have a stronger hand that we can go all in for (eg. AK, AQ, JJ or higher)and other small stacks/medium stack would call thinking “this guy doesnt have many chips left so he has some hand like K9, A10, 44 etc.” and will call.

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Pokerkid Reply:
February 28th, 2010 at 7:13 pm

Also, we have three ppl behind, cash game and two have every reason to call with the same hand suited, mid-pair, just to luck out. They could also have a better hand which is highly plausible like QQ, JJ where itll be a 3-4 hand game and your overcards look skeptical. even with top pair, someone could easily have AK, AQ or hit their small set. You also dont know what the original raiser has. Hes playing loose and he probably has a similar hand or better. In 99% cases we would fold, be patient, knowing he would probably make the same move again in future hands and punish him with KK, AK, AA or QQ

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Anonymous Reply:
March 1st, 2010 at 9:24 am

In 6 hands we will have paid 1k SB, 2k BB and 1.2K ante. So we have 3.5K left which is less then min-raise. How do you wait 10-15 hands?

The only choice is call now or blind shove any two. I’dd snap call this any day.

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u cant call a shove with such a hand, especially on the cut off position, it would be a donk move if u do.

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Anonymous Reply:
February 26th, 2010 at 6:17 am

So what are your other options here with the stack we have? We almost certainly aren’t going to sneak into the money before having to get our chips in somehow. If we fold here, we are basically committing ourselves to shoving with one of the next four hands before the blinds come round (or praying for a good hand on the blinds).

As we’re such a short stack, any hand we push from hereon in is likely to be a threeway at best, so even if we do get a good hand to go with it’s going to be devalued.

Our opponent is aggressive so I am putting him on a wide range here, especially as we are close to the bubble. I’d say there is a small chance we are dominated, a decent chance we are ahead and a decent chance we’re flipping against an underpair.

Can you explain why you think this is a bad call rather than just calling it a ‘donk move’?

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WasteOfPaint Reply:
February 26th, 2010 at 6:18 am

^^ that reply was me by the way, just noticed I made it anonymously.

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Voted call for the reasons the other posters mentioned. Likely behind here, but not much choice. At best, folding may get the other short to shove and potentially get bubbled. Hero would still be last however, and with M<2 you can’t count on KQ+ coming anytime soon.

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WasteOfPaint Reply:
February 26th, 2010 at 6:21 am

We don’t even have the possibility of the other short bubbling here – he has already folded.

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samo Reply:
February 26th, 2010 at 6:25 am

My mistake … still calling.

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John Kugelman Reply:
February 26th, 2010 at 7:51 am

Agree with calling. We’re not even “likely behind”. KQ is a monster!

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Anonymous Reply:
February 28th, 2010 at 3:15 pm

If you’re likely behind as you say, you do have a choice here. Fold and live to play another hand.

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I voted call, I think WasteOfPaint has got it spot on.

Even if we waited for player B to get KOd, it says we are two players away from the bubble, not the bubble itself so still wouldnt make the cash by doing that.

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I voted fold. It was close, and KQ might be the best hand we’ll see bfore we have to get it in, but were definitely behind if not crushed and I think we can find that scenario again in the next few hands. Even tho V is aggressive, he’s not shoving light here with two large stacks behind who can easily call and bubble him out. Id rather take my chances in the next few hands, hoping to be the opener. Id also rather have a “weaker” hand like suited connectors if we’re calling all in in a potential multiway pot….KQo just has too much of a chance of being dominated and not enough of a chance of winning multiway.

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WasteOfPaint Reply:
February 26th, 2010 at 9:47 am

In this situation, I am not convinced that being the opener rather than the caller holds any advantage whatsoever. Whatever we push with, we are in early position with a very low stack, so it’s incredibly likely we will get at least a couple of callers, making us a big dog. I don’t think there is that much chance of being dominated here – I think his range is much more likely 77 – JJ than AQ+ or QQ+.

Basically, I think we’re choosing between a probable flip now or a 3 to 1 shot in a couple of hands’ time. I know which I’d prefer to give me a shot at making the cash.

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_CityBorn_ Reply:
February 26th, 2010 at 10:35 am

I hear ya, but I think differently about several points in your analysis.

A) you discount AQ+ and QQ+ from the range of a guy shoving on the bubble against several players with stacks big enough to call. I dont see how you can do that.

B) “Probable flip now vs a 3 to 1 shot” assumes a couple of things. 1. that no one calls behind now, and that either youre crushed when you get it in later or at least a couple of people call at that point. I dont assume that no one will call now, in fact, if any of the big stacks find a top hand, I think they call to end the bubble and take a shot at two small stacks. Also, Im happier with the second scenario than you are (except if we happen to be crushed). First of all every hand we dont play gives us a chance to sneak into the money without risking our tourney life. Ive seen it happen too many times to discount the possibility that a couple hands from now, we’ve snuck in. Also, as for the 3 to 1, I dont assume we’ll be dominated if the goal is either to find primos or get it in with smaller suited connecting type hands. Im ok with a 3 to 1 shot if it means we’re in a 4 way pot and winning means giving ourselves life for a potential run. At least if we’re going to be in a crappy scenario, the upside is giving ourselves ammo for a potential bigger payday. Again, a scenario Ive seen many a time.

I guess what Im saying is I just dont see this spot as much better than something we can find a blittle ways down the road. instead, Id rather try to luck out and sneak in, or end up in any of a number of other scenarios as appealing as this one later.

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Jake28wv Reply:
November 15th, 2011 at 7:03 pm

You guys are insane if u think that we have to be behind here. The guy shoving has 11.5 bb’s and it’s close to the bubble. It has already been stated the guy has been aggressive and his position on the table he could show up with atc j.10s 7.8s etc hands we dominate.And oh well if we’re wrong **** happens. If the table is tight and I’m that guy I’m pushing all kinds of hands here and trying to chip that stack up before the bubble pops. If I push q.j into aces and bubble oh well I’m trying to chip up now and get a nice stack to double and give myself a good shot to ship it not min cash.

I’m calling here. I honestly would rather take a shot now with a halfway decent hand than wait a few more hands and face being blinded out. Theres nothing worse than that. If we were on the exact bubble and I really just wanted to sneak into the money than maybe I’d wait it out a few more hands and hope someone else goes out. But its time to get busy livin or get busy dyin…

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Voted fold also. I would have had no problem with shoving KQ here, but I don’t like calling it. Even if we have v on a wide range, we’re behind the majority of it. I’ve found it often pays off to be patient in these near-bubble situations as aggressive players will make a mistake and take themselves out.
I can definitely see the argument for calling and I don’t consider it a donk play – it’s a legit enough hand to call with as the short stack, but I’d personally have to have a really strong read on V to call.

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Fold. KQ is a dog against villian’s shoving range. Villian is making a steal here, but he has to have something to make this play. Villian probably has any weak ace or A-10+, maybe even a pocket pair.

We have 5 more hands to play, and we can even open for a raise when the big blind hits villian. The table might all fold to the blinds, and villian will raise.

I would rather take my chances waiting. There are much better spots, and to call a shove this late in the tournament, you need a better hand, simple as that.

My range for CALLING would be at least Ax, A-10, A-J or any pocket pair. When I coin flip, I want to be ahead even if I’m just a slight favorite.

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you gotta take your chances here with less than 4X the big blind. you prob arent going to find a better spot against an aggressive player.

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Fold

Mainly because the stacks of the BB and SB relative to D’s stack could call him down without fear.

This means that D can not rely on their fear of elimination because, quite frankly, they don’t have anything to fear.

This means that the probability of D showing with air is lower, and the probability he has a legitimate hand is higher.

Aggressive is not maniac. Aggressive is not try to abuse the bubble against the big stack. Aggression is commonly a necessary facet to become proficient in to be a long-term winner.

Hopefully and odds are you will catch an A or better between now and the BB–then open shove

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My vote was fold — shove it, sure.. call it, no thanks.

One thing I noticed none of the other posters took into account is that if this is the money bubble, there are likely other tables still in the tourney. You may be short stack at this table, but say it’s 63 paid, not 9. You’ve got a lot of other players to wait out.. not just player “B” in the diagram.

I’ve got no problem shoving anything better than q7 suited with a stack like this, but you can wait past this hand. Calling any raise is foolish right now.

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to everybody, KQ is not a monster hand. You are also forgetting the three players behind which could have anything since they havent made their play. Ace anything in theory is a better hand and im sure online people will call with something like A8,9,10. Also, we’re not so short stacked and we have 7-8 more hands. We have to be patient. I would not put 7k+ (because original raise was 23k) into the pot with KQ unsuited. Im certain more ppl will call behind because they have large stack and mysteryhand (AK+ they would call)is not good enough. Yes its devaluing future hands, but i rather have the security that 70% i have better odds than to make a haste call with KQ

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